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Blizzard Bans Single Player Cheaters
 
Wrythe1985  posted on Oct 12, 2010 6:20:35 PM - Report post

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uuh...DABhand....it's not their software.....yeah they created it and I cannot copy it and sell it/make money off of it in any way. But by purchasing the game I have bought legal rights to the SP portion of the software to do with as I please provided no monetary gains are made/proper credit is given. this very argument has been the subject of several cases in the US legal system (not sure about the UK though, i will admit.) Every time the courts ruled in favor of the cheaters citing the FTC's privacy laws, personal property laws and ownership laws. MP is different because you are using another person/company's server, you are obstensibly causeing harm to another customer by ruining their experience, etc. but SP mode is legally yours...if Blizz didn't want the cheats...they shouldn't have released a SP to the public, period.
 
PWizard  posted on Oct 12, 2010 6:32:37 PM - Report post

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@DABhand -- I treated you with respect up until the point that you started disrespecting me and this website. Same goes for everyone else, paying member or not. If people treat me with respect, they get the same in return. Purchasing a membership does NOT grant someone the license to make outrageous demands, post ridiculous comments about how we don't care about our customers because we don't have an updated out within 37 seconds of an unannounced patch being released, or shout out to the world that we lace all of our downloads with filthy trojans.

If we treated our customers so badly then we wouldn't have a 90%+ year over year renewal rate for our unlimited memberships since the day we opened our doors. The truth is that we go out of our way to make our customers happy, even if it means losing money on less than AAA titles by publishing requested trainers and options and supporting some trainers through 50+ game patches while other groups put out a single trainer and say forget it. We also spend time working on REAL game versions (something you of all people should appreciate) instead of just the "scene" versions like all of our other trainer making friends. We spend HOURS and DAYS working around anti-cheat steam triggers so that our customers that actually purchased the game can have a working trainer.

Your original post said that the whole Blizzard debacle was 50% our fault. I disagree. It's 100% Blizzard's fault as NO ONE should EVER be banned for cheating in a SINGLE PLAYER game. Period. I think people have made that abundantly clear.

 
Hikikomori  posted on Oct 12, 2010 6:53:01 PM - Report post

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DABhand,

The people who work on this website and make trainers for everyone here and for the people who visite. They dont have to do it to be truthful. If they wanted to they could close it down with out a sec thought. Really they love what they do even tho theres alot people who do complain.

The point is they want us to have fun with games we play. If you have trouble getting past a spot on a game, they are here to help. But understand they have 100's have requests and 100's of other trainers they need to make or edit or what else they do.

Give them some respect for what they do. Its the right thing to do really. Shoot I even donated $100 to them just because I like there website and really how fast they bring out trainers. Give them time it mite take a week to a month, this only place I have found that trainers dont have trojins or vires in them. I 100% support them for that. Shoot here in few more weeks will donate again because how much I do like this place.

For Blizzard yes they have the right to ban us on multi-player. Soon has we buy the game the cd the program is ours now not Blizzards anymore. So the single-player we can edit it all we want. How I know this is because I payed a layer $1,000 to confirm this infomation. The policy is only there for to protect multi-users not for single-players. By law if you hack into another players game then yes Blizzard has the rights do anything they want, plus its there server. In single player mode AI is not a person so the law ends. Now if Blizzard add something about hack or using other trainers to miss with the AI then they have all rights to ban us. Well its something like that my layer told me how it works but you know how layers talk lol.

 
Neo7  posted on Oct 12, 2010 6:54:03 PM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by DABhand

quote:
originally posted by PWizard

@DABhand -- So far every argument you have made on Blizzard's behalf has been discredited. You come here spouting off things hoping that no one will notice that you actually have no idea what you are talking about. Now your argument is that Blizzard is in the right because of what they MIGHT do down the road. Just like Blizzard banning people because they used cheats in SP and MIGHT play a MP game one day. It's a good thing that police don't arrest people for things they MIGHT do one day.

If you want to jump on the Blizzard blind bandwagon, then be my guest, just don't come here spreading false information trying to sway others.

Chris come down from that Donald Trump-esque world in your head and actually read what I had said.

Show me where I am pro Blizzard? I gave my view on what was said in that article, and I also said ultimately they do have the right.

Also notice I said I think it was bad of them to ban people this way.

Yes please do read, before you spout out things hoping no-one will notice.

Just because I pointed out that it is their software and they can do what they like, does not mean I am going to run around the streets with a Blizzard T-shirt and megaphone declaring they are great. Really Chris your little domination of the paid trainer market has really gone to your head that you don't realise who you alienate as you wander on your road.

Look at how you have acted, when I was helping you and was a voice for your concerns everything was nicey nicey, now there is no need I am treated like trash.

Not only just me, I have seen the way you respond to people... Paying customers, that is bad really bad. Its as if you took their money now you can be rude to them.

And to top it all off, you and your mods have been letting the warez talk go mental more often, maybe because you realise that a high percentage of your customers are heavy warez users so you don't want to frighten potentials off.

Either way, as said I responded to the article and gave my views, I didn't post as a "Yay Blizzard" fanboi.. Jesus honestly.

As for your "Now your argument is that Blizzard is in the right because of what they MIGHT do down the road.".. LOL NOOOOOOOOO, that is NOT what I said.. Re-read again. Paranoia lad I think you have tonnes of it.

Link

There's no excuse for not reporting messages. Ever. Don't assume my moding procedures have change in anyway. I'm pretty busy with a full semester with lots of stuff as I near graduation so I'm sorry I am unable to devote more of my time to voluntarily go hunt down bad messages without any aid from the community through Reporting Messages.

[Edited by moderator Neo7, 10/12/2010 6:58:15 PM]

 
Bes  posted on Oct 12, 2010 7:05:39 PM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by DABhand

Not only just me, I have seen the way you respond to people... Paying customers, that is bad really bad. Its as if you took their money now you can be rude to them.

And to top it all off, you and your mods have been letting the warez talk go mental more often, maybe because you realise that a high percentage of your customers are heavy warez users so you don't want to frighten potentials off.

As for the first one, there are users that repeatedly get told about the trainer troubleshooting guide, told to disable their AV etc. Then, they turn around and complain AGAIN for the same issue. To be honest, I think PWizard has done a great job of customer service. The second one makes no sense. If there were REALLY as much warez talk as to necessitate more moderators, I'm sure there would be. Don't kid yourself, PWizard and the mods know full well what goes on on the boards. What I don't get is what this has to do with Blizzard and the banning SP cheaters issue. Let's not divide ourselves here and focus on the problem at hand.

 
DarthMudcrab  posted on Oct 12, 2010 8:16:33 PM - Report post

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Just out of interest Chris, do you see this incident as negative or positive press? Furthermore, do you foresee this having any effect on purchases of your trainers and guides?

Also, I've noticed DABhand, I think it was, saying that Chris is just trying to maximise his profit by undermining the work of the games industry with his trainers. Three things:

Firstly, OF COURSE HE'S TRYING TO MAXIMISE HIS PROFIT. This website is a business, and he has every right to try and make as much profit from it as he can. That's how business works. If you start a business without the intent of making money, you'll get laughed out of the bank.

Secondly, he isn't trying to undermine anybody, least of all the games industry. I don't think he condones cheating in MP at all, and all he is doing in this circumstance is standing up to the totalitarian bent that Blizzard has got into its head regarding any third-party changes to its games as an affront to them. You're misconstruing the rights of software owners as biting the hand that feeds them.

Thirdly, if you don't condone cheating in any form, why are you on this site?

 
PWizard  posted on Oct 13, 2010 4:05:17 AM - Report post

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@DarthMudcrab -- Thanks for the comments. We didn't really set out to generate positive or negative press with the article. We simply felt that it wasn't fair for Blizzard to basically be able to "repossess" someone's game simply for the reason that they cheated in single player mode. The article probably had a negative effect on purchases of the SC2 trainer, but the message itself is much more important. I don't foresee it having any effect on other games or guides. We will continue to do what we have always done and hope that consumers will take a stand against bullies like Blizzard.
 
DABhand  posted on Oct 13, 2010 5:23:16 AM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by PWizard

@DABhand -- I treated you with respect up until the point that you started disrespecting me and this website. Same goes for everyone else, paying member or not. If people treat me with respect, they get the same in return. Purchasing a membership does NOT grant someone the license to make outrageous demands, post ridiculous comments about how we don't care about our customers because we don't have an updated out within 37 seconds of an unannounced patch being released, or shout out to the world that we lace all of our downloads with filthy trojans.

If we treated our customers so badly then we wouldn't have a 90%+ year over year renewal rate for our unlimited memberships since the day we opened our doors. The truth is that we go out of our way to make our customers happy, even if it means losing money on less than AAA titles by publishing requested trainers and options and supporting some trainers through 50+ game patches while other groups put out a single trainer and say forget it. We also spend time working on REAL game versions (something you of all people should appreciate) instead of just the "scene" versions like all of our other trainer making friends. We spend HOURS and DAYS working around anti-cheat steam triggers so that our customers that actually purchased the game can have a working trainer.

Your original post said that the whole Blizzard debacle was 50% our fault. I disagree. It's 100% Blizzard's fault as NO ONE should EVER be banned for cheating in a SINGLE PLAYER game. Period. I think people have made that abundantly clear.

Chris...

You disrespected myself first for no reason, out of the blue from a post I made, which led to you falsely accusing me of something I haven't done.

And you have niggled me in a few other posts since then, look at the PS3 thread, It started off with me being positive and hoping it will be great, but no you had to come around and bring the mood down and you actually attacked me in the same thread.

Do you deny this? Of course you can't.

Disrespecting the site? Jesus what drugs are you on. I have never disrespected this site, I have actually defended it on many forms.

As for the 50% fault yes of course it is, you had known that SC2 was an online required game, for activation and just normal SP gameplay, there was always a smattering of doubt over the chances of things going wrong due to their checking for changes constantly on the customers end. So you had to at least use some common sense and give a possible warning to users that it may be best to play in offline mode while using a trainer.

Its not difficult and only takes a few seconds and people are protected much more than those who use it while the game is connected to servers.

And to be honest with you, I am not 100% certain they were banned for SP cheating, is any of them going to put their hands up and say... "Damn I tried a MP match and pressed an option button and was de-synced from the server" Nahh they wont. Cause how many who did get the trainer and did not get banned even when connected to servers?


Anyways lets not talk to each other now Chris, because I am sure it will get worse.

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