If the game did not utilize the z co-ordinates the game would be really FLAT, as in flat world.
The game was 3D fully, you could swim up and down, you could go up hills and come down them again, mountains etc.
Just because the game missed out on ladders on the world map that you could climb up and down on doesn't mean its not 3D. The game did have ladders although they were map changing places, to be able to have all that in the world would require quite more memory usage for area's that have them, more pre-rendering etc.
So your facepalm is invalid
I appreciate your response, but it only serves to confuse me further. At no point did I mention destruction of the environment, and the title is a play on words. The crux is simply keeping some really entertaining mechanisms from older titles in the "latest and greatest" ones.
Games seem to be regressing in their complexity.Mechanisms are used to facilitate actions which can only be performed by the item/object itself. For example: Bionic Commando's grapple-arm is a mechanism. Zelda's boomerang is a mechanism. Metroid's Morph Ball is a mechanism.
At it's most basic level, my post was asking why we need to seek outside influence or talent beyond the original designers of a game in order to improve it? One of my examples was the lack of freedom of movement vertically. What if I want to be a theif or assassin character who has the ability to scale vertical faces by means of a rope/grapple? What I have seen in games is a tendency to favour a ladder or stairs as the only way to traverse heights without the use of magic, hence 2.5D, the not-quite-using the Z-axis within 3D games. (And I don't mean the visual trick with funny glasses.)
How is this not clear? With all respect I can convey it text, please, if you can do but one thing, find Might & Magic: Dark Messiah and play it. Then, imagine the possibilities if you could import those mechanics into a vast, open world like Oblivion, instead of Dark Messiah's limited, linear world. Only through experience can we share understanding where my words seem to fail.
I'll not be any more verbose than this.
[Edited by spAzz77, 2/26/2011 8:13:40 PM]
Missed the point entirely.
My use of the term 'ladder' was to denote the lack of originality in traversing vertical obstacles. Why not have a zip-line across house-roofs instead of the ubiquitous wooden plank? Why not have the ability to sneak into a house via a second story window using a grapple, instead of the overused 'balcony'?
Also, I never said anything was flat. That would be 2D. By using 2.5D as a tongue-in-cheek reference to the boring over-land travel in the Elder Scrolls games.
Moreover, I posted to start a discussion, more or less, about what we all may feel is missing in games and what we enjoyed in the past would be enjoyable to see now, not to be nit-picked, cross-examined, or wholeheartedly misunderstood.
I'm sticking to Twitter. Anything beyond 140 characters seems to get misconstrued these days.
Well if you're going to reply to people posting opposition against what you believe in this manner, I don't see a reason to keep this topic open.