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Why did I ever buy this game
 
tommy6860  posted on Nov 18, 2010 3:06:16 PM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by Immolare

Oblivion > Fallout 3/NV is definitely true. I rather play as a mage or warrior then a guy with a gun. I like slashing and shooting fireballs at enemies much better.

But isn't that more of a preference than stating some quality of the actual game? I love RPGs period and the Fallout series (especially 3) is awesome. Oblivion was awesome as well, except for the nasty framerate and loading issues it had when it was first released. If you prefer using magical powers in a medieval type setting for game preference, that's great. I can go either way as far as RPGs go. I thought the humor and the mechanics in Fallout were great. I thought being mage in Oblivion was awesome. Oblivion certainly was the best looking game as far as graphics go. But then again, it didn't deal with a post apocalyptic nuclear landscape either.

If you liked Oblivion, then you would like Dragon Age:Origins, which IMO, is the best overall RPG I have played to date.

 
kbernstar  posted on Nov 18, 2010 3:27:43 PM - Report post

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Planescape Torment > BG2 > Fallout 1/2 > first Kotor > Dragon Age > everything else

I never understood the appeal of Oblivion and the entire genre of free-form RPGs for the computer. It's trying too hard to replicate the feel of freeform RPG of the paper and pencil days except it lacks that true dynamic element of a dungeon master.

I always ended up feeling like I had to grind out every little tiny tedious task like looking in every cabinet and cupboard of every abandoned house and pickpocketing every random NPC on the offchance I might miss some quest starting key or note and that just gets boring after the first 90000 houses and NPCs you run through in the first town and then you download a nuke launching crossbow and kill everyone then you download a Japanese nude patch to see what sort of hentai tentacle porn you can put Captain Picard's character in with a schoolgirl and never play the game again.

I feel people criticize linearity simply because it's some obscure catchphrase people don't understand and it makes them sound relevant. But knowing that your only choice is to go from point A to point B doesn't mean the journey has to be devoid of entertainment when almost all of the most brilliant games in history have been linear.

[Edited by kbernstar, 11/18/2010 3:31:26 PM]

 
42N8Son  posted on Nov 18, 2010 4:05:35 PM - Report post

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I completely agree. Oblivion is THE best RPG ever made next to Morrowind. There's more detail in Oblivion than there is in Fallout 3/NV as well. All the shops, taverns, and hotels are so elegant in their design. Fallout is just a drab world (and I understand that's the way it's supposed to be because it's a post apocalyptic world) but there's so many unusable broken terminals and filing cabinets laying around it makes everything so repetitive looking.

Also, Fallout NV isn't supposed to have been hit with any WMD atomic bombs so why do 99% of the building interiors look just like Fallout 3 building interiors with all the debris clutter? They should have created a more "clean" look in Fallout NV but they were too lazy and cheap so they just re-used the same crap from the Fallout 3 world that was destroyed by WMD atomic bombs. I guess some folks just like all the guns and explosives in the Fallout 3/NV world and aren't interested in magic, swords, and just natural exterior beauty (trees, streams, lakes, rivers, flowers, mountains).

I also have to say that the HGEC female and Roberts body mods for Oblivion OWN the models of Fallout 3/NV by far even if you use HiRes Type 3 females and Breeze's male body mods for Fallout. Too many body seams (neck especially) and the bodies are so plain looking and unsexy. The female body mods of Oblivion are awesome and even allow breasts and butts to slightly bounce and jiggle while walking/running/jumping. It's just so awesome and realistic looking. Other graphical mods add depth of field, blur, and other visual effects that make the Oblivion world look VERY realistic compared to Fallout. Of course Oblivion has been around a lot longer than either Fallout 3/NV so it has had the edge in regards to mods and mod content but just comparing Fallout 3/NV to Oblivion vanilla I'd still prefer the sword/magic/natural beauty setup over guns and explosions and drab game world any day.

There's so many games that already have guns and explosions in them already that are much better than Fallout 3/NV could ever hope to achieve. It's only real asset is the extreme gore that most other gun/explosive games don't tend to render. But even Fallout NV copied over the same gore and limb severing features of Fallout 3. They didn't even add the option for groin shots that were available in Fallout 1 and 2. All Fallout NV really is - is just a new game world that reuses 99% of the world content of Fallout 3. And it's so buggy that people would be better off just buying and playing Fallout 3.

 
tommy6860  posted on Nov 18, 2010 6:32:21 PM - Report post

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I never understood the appeal of Oblivion and the entire genre of free-form RPGs for the computer. It's trying too hard to replicate the feel of freeform RPG of the paper and pencil days except it lacks that true dynamic element of a dungeon master.

That's not a logical comparison, since one uses the imagination and the other actually uses visuals (graphics) to play out the game. The experiences are much different. Now I am not saying that pen and paper games are not exiting, they can be for those who'd rather use the imagination, instead of grinding through graphics; it is (and mostly) all preference.

I always ended up feeling like I had to grind out every little tiny tedious task like looking in every cabinet and cupboard of every abandoned house and pickpocketing every random NPC on the offchance I might miss some quest starting key or note and that just gets boring after the first 90000 houses and NPCs you run through in the first town and then you download a nuke launching crossbow and kill everyone then you download a Japanese nude patch to see what sort of hentai tentacle porn you can put Captain Picard's character in with a schoolgirl and never play the game again.

Again it is all preference. You simply may not like that kind of game and honestly, I think you're putting a bit of hyperbole on how games like Oblivion, Fallout and especially Dragon Age play. Yes, there are all of those containers that have useful and many times, repetitive needless items, but that is the game. After one plays it a while, they typically ignore them or open them to possibly find an item that is useful for their character build. The modding you reference is just a side item, I find it fun to be able to customize your character or aspects of the game.

Also, mostly, quests are not relegated to simply finding an item in these games either as a prompt to start said quest, they are typically activated by events or one's action and then prompts are open as to what is the "next to do on the list" quest-line. It seems you like RPGs, but you romanticize of the old style pre-digital days of gaming. Things change and that is how it is. I liked those game as well, but I like the digital version just as much.

I feel people criticize linearity simply because it's some obscure catchphrase people don't understand and it makes them sound relevant. But knowing that your only choice is to go from point A to point B doesn't mean the journey has to be devoid of entertainment when almost all of the most brilliant games in history have been linear.

That may be true and I agree to an extent. There is use for linear games where they fit, but for the most part, they do not fit well in RPGs where they tend to be exploratory and sandbox in style. Mass Effect is an exception where it works really well. FFXIII is where it fails since they went away from what was an open field of exploring. Linearity only works for direct action in games, and they typically are racers and shooters. There's something to be said about the aesthetics of open world exploration instead of being forced on rails to go from point to point as it typically makes the game play out with no discovery. RPGs tend to have discoveries where quest points are activated. Linear games also don't give a sense of adventure is they are designed for point "A" to "B" gameplay, it just is what it is.

 
tommy6860  posted on Nov 18, 2010 7:07:32 PM - Report post

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42N8Son said: I completely agree. Oblivion is THE best RPG ever made next to Morrowind. There's more detail in Oblivion than there is in Fallout 3/NV as well. All the shops, taverns, and hotels are so elegant in their design. Fallout is just a drab world (and I understand that's the way it's supposed to be because it's a post apocalyptic world) but there's so many unusable broken terminals and filing cabinets laying around it makes everything so repetitive looking.

That's a preference in how you liked the games. Many will say the opposite. I liked Oblivion and Fallout about the same, but they're totally different in styles, considering one is medieval and the other a futuristic apocalyptic wasteland survival grind.

Also, Fallout NV isn't supposed to have been hit with any WMD atomic bombs so why do 99% of the building interiors look just like Fallout 3 building interiors with all the debris clutter? They should have created a more "clean" look in Fallout NV but they were too lazy and cheap so they just re-used the same crap from the Fallout 3 world that was destroyed by WMD atomic bombs.

Well, it was explained that the periphery of Vegas was hit with bombs while the actual downtown area only suffered minor damage and effects from the nuclear attacks, so it is fitting. Downtown is certainly much cleaner looking than the rest, but it isn't immune to the disasters of the surrounding areas, so it needs food water and other items brought in that can degrade the looks. It is a post-apocalyptic setting, so everything cannot be pristine.

I guess some folks just like all the guns and explosives in the Fallout 3/NV world and aren't interested in magic, swords, and just natural exterior beauty (trees, streams, lakes, rivers, flowers, mountains).

Well, that is just preference on your part. Some people like guns and bombs and other what you like, I like both in RPGs as that is a good variance for the genre. It is supposed to be drab and I doubt that in the real world that we'd still have greenery going on in a post-nuclear attack milieu. If you like mages, magic, swords, etc, then you'd like Dragon Age: Origins. Dragon Age blows away Oblivion hands down for gameplay and it is much longer to play. It isn't a pretty, but overall, I would rate it the best RPG I have played to date. What I mean by overall is everything regarding an RPG, story, graphics, gameplay, etc. If want to categorize, IMO; Mass effect is the best story ever, DA:O has the best gamplay, Oblivion is the prettiest. Fallout has the best elements of a shooter RPG build.

I also have to say that the HGEC female and Roberts body mods for Oblivion OWN the models of Fallout 3/NV by far even if you use HiRes Type 3 females and Breeze's male body mods for Fallout. Too many body seams (neck especially) and the bodies are so plain looking and unsexy. The female body mods of Oblivion are awesome and even allow breasts and butts to slightly bounce and jiggle while walking/running/jumping. It's just so awesome and realistic looking. Other graphical mods add depth of field, blur, and other visual effects that make the Oblivion world look VERY realistic compared to Fallout. Of course Oblivion has been around a lot longer than either Fallout 3/NV so it has had the edge in regards to mods and mod content but just comparing Fallout 3/NV to Oblivion vanilla I'd still prefer the sword/magic/natural beauty setup over guns and explosions and drab game world any day.

The game engine still puts out the graphics and to be honest, I don't see anything spectacular with the best of Oblivion's mods that Fallout 3 has as well. There are mods for 3 that are more detailed than the ones you listed for Oblivion by their respective creators. If you're into nude mods, there's a guy who made one really detailed, and I like it big time. IF you want to see detailed people mods and graphics, Dragon Age blows them all away. The character models in Bethesda games have always been funny looking, lacking any detail. But Dragon Age is incredible looking for the people. But Bioware excels at that.

There's so many games that already have guns and explosions in them already that are much better than Fallout 3/NV could ever hope to achieve. It's only real asset is the extreme gore that most other gun/explosive games don't tend to render. But even Fallout NV copied over the same gore and limb severing features of Fallout 3. They didn't even add the option for groin shots that were available in Fallout 1 and 2. All Fallout NV really is - is just a new game world that reuses 99% of the world content of Fallout 3. And it's so buggy that people would be better off just buying and playing Fallout 3.

I agree there's are a lot of games with guns and explosives, but we live in modern times and most folks prefers those kinds of games; that's why shooters are the biggest selling genre in gaming today. I agree that Vegas is a rehash of 3 and I pretty much got bored with it when I expected at least some differences from even the first two games.

Fallout 3 was at least innovative in the series and that's why i liked it so much. Keep in mind when you mention bugs, Oblivion was a mess when it was released and Fallout 3 was bad, but Vegas takes the cake. Fallouts 1&2 were pretty bad, but that's says more about the devs QA processes. For the most part, the same people that did Vegas did 1&2 as well.

 
ServiusTheBear  posted on Nov 19, 2010 12:06:00 AM - Report post

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Am like gona completly forget your dishing games that I love. Actualy na. Seriusly I have read that pritty much everyone the comments on games even reviewers payed or un paid, Pull out on the bugs and glitches. Why Cause its the easy way to go. That really ticks me off. You wana do it right and not just focus on the glitches and bugs.

Since am now studying Games art and animation I can tell you that getting it PERFECT! which everyone seems to want. Is not easy at all. If you cant respect that a game with such magnatude is going to have glitches and bugs. Then dont comment Seriusly I mean it. Or even that fact dont buy any games. Cause typing on and on and on. Dose not help one bit. You just end up sounding like a girl that has had her hair pulled. (no flaming intended if the mods see this, That comment is used as a hypo)

Now You want to dish Fallout 1 and 2 why???

A. Fallout 1 was made back in 1997.
B. Story line was and still is great.
C. Graphics back then where great. Now there ok. (Still playable if you have mental capacity to get yourself paste flashy graphics of today.)
D. Length is good. (If you did not rush through it or cheat)

Fallout 2

A. Continues on from F01 great.
B. Story line great still trying to save your people.
C. Again Graphics back then where great. Now there ok. (Still playable if you have mental capacity to get yourself paste flashy graphics of today.)
D. Game play is fun.
E. Length is good.

Now Oblivion.

A. Great graphics. (Yes taverns and hotels where elegant)
B. Story line is cool.
C. Game play great, Interaction is good, missions are good to.
D. Length is awesome.
E. A few graphical glitches. (mainly with me tweeking)

Fallout 3

A. Great graphics again. Location is good mmmm DC wasteland.
B. Story line Orignal in its on way. (Even tho you start in a vault like in Fallout 1.)
C. Game play great. Interaction is good to.
D. Story line is great to.
E. Length is great to.
F. Again a few graphical glitches. (mainly with me tweeking)

I wont comment on Final Fantasy games why cause they have went to far. To me after FF8 it got boring. Plus the cartoonyness on to me and annoyed the hell out of me.

Mass Effect 1 and 2

A. Great Graphics.
B. Great Story line.
C. Great Game play.
D. Length was good.

Now the next game am waiting for is ME3

 
kbernstar  posted on Nov 19, 2010 7:09:04 AM - Report post

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You won't even acknowledge the bugs you see just because you like a game but you're telling me you're trying to get into video game design?

From the game reviews you gave for the 5 games, the biggest thing for you seems to be flashy graphics.

 
tommy6860  posted on Nov 19, 2010 7:25:33 AM - Report post

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Am like gona completly forget your dishing games that I love. Actualy na. Seriusly I have read that pritty much everyone the comments on games even reviewers payed or un paid, Pull out on the bugs and glitches. Why Cause its the easy way to go. That really ticks me off. You wana do it right and not just focus on the glitches and bugs.

Oh please, now you're resorting to drama. The games have bugs, to say they don't would be flat out lying. Go to the Bethesda forums and you'll read officially created threads regarding big time fixes for Vegas. Fallout 3 had serious issues when it came out, but after quite a few patches it played pretty well. You simply cannot differentiate that (at least from what I have been saying) that I love these games. My bugs/glitches beef with Vegas is the same beef I had with Oblivion, and the other Fallouts. The main reason I didn't get into Vegas is that is played too much like Fallout 3, nothing innovative and a lot recycled from that game. You keep painting a picture that these issues are not there by your experiences while you are in the extreme minority.

Since am now studying Games art and animation I can tell you that getting it PERFECT! which everyone seems to want. Is not easy at all. If you cant respect that a game with such magnatude is going to have glitches and bugs. Then dont comment Seriusly I mean it. Or even that fact dont buy any games. Cause typing on and on and on. Dose not help one bit. You just end up sounding like a girl that has had her hair pulled. (no flaming intended if the mods see this, That comment is used as a hypo)

Seriously, you need to get over yourself if you're going to demand that others not comment on the negatives of a game, just so it doesn't upset you. I don't care if you owned Bethesda, if you actually study what you say you do, I would expect that you would want a higher standard of quality considering the fact that these games have been historically buggy messes going back to Fallout 1, even though they were great concepts, and gameplay. You would think that after this many games that it wouldn't get this bad.

As far as your mini-reviews of these games, the Fallout and Oblivion didn't really have much of a story within each game as they are a saga of sort. Mass Effect certainly did and probably has one of the best ever. But Mass Effect on console had serious framerate issues and texture pop-ins, something Bioware admitted to and fixed with ME2.

But anyway, I wonder if you are purposefully just favoring anything Bethesda or you're wearing rose colored glasses, especially after saying that Oblivion (in your mini-review) had a few graphical glitches mainly due to your tweeking. Of course it is the same engine used to make Fallout 3 and Vegas, so I guess those two having more bugs meant that the first use of that engine was polished, right?

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