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POLL: Was it worth it to you?
 
ArchDuke  posted on Jan 15, 2010 3:47:24 PM - Report post


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quote:
originally posted by changerofwayz

I never played Left for Dead 1 before buying Left for Dead 2. So I enjoyed playing Left for dead 2 with no prior frame of reference. I liked it alot.

Then I bought Left for dead 1 for £6 from steam a few weeks later...played it...and I actually thought it was BETTER then left for dead 2 which was funny to me. The scenarios and the characters from L4D1 are better then in L4D2...I havent really completed either game yet, I just tend to pick up and play multiplayer when I am bored.

I didnt pay $50 for it I paid £26 which is around $40 (off the top of my head currency conversion, its almost $50 anyway), either way for then fun I had playing left for dead 2, I personally think the price tag is fair, although I do see what people are saying about L4D2 being an expansion of left for dead 1.

Same here, I bought L4D2 without playing L4D1, and I gotta say I'm satisfied with it.

 
Agravier  posted on Feb 04, 2010 7:31:15 PM - Report post

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no way not for $50.

I got mine for $34 from a 4pack that some guys in my CSS clan shared expenses for which made it worth it.

 
Zeth_Durron  posted on Feb 04, 2010 10:13:45 PM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by sanctionedforce

I vote no for several reasons.

Most of this is in defense of my opinion and directed at Zeth_Durron's difficult-to-swallow "argument" to the validity of releasing Left 4 Dead 2 as a separate game.

The look, feel, action, environment, goals, etc. are exactly the same as the first game. There are some differences; none of which could individually require a separate game to implement.

The idea that bugs are a valid reason for making l4d2 a new and separate game is silly. The elimination of bugs is the main reason for patching any application. (Why should a poorly implemented DLC capability be corrected when one can disguise a potential expansion as a completely separate game?) If you'll recall, the single player campaign is called a campaign (ironic isn't it). Some RTS's come with many campaigns; others, a few; still others, only one. Quite a few games offer the ability to add campaigns, via 3rd party mods, expansions, etc.

You referenced the DLC for Fallout, some of which didn't even (technically) happen in the same world as the original campaign (simulations, spaceships, et al), but they were still DLC and built on the core mechanics of the original game.

L4D2 is NO different. The director 2.0 you tout is no different than another set of scripts run when a level is played through. This is not a difficult task for a game designer to implement. This level automatically runs this set of scripts, plot data, actors, weapons, models, etc., etc.. Unless the designers were complete retards, it is no problem at all to change (with the original tools, of course) what set of scripts and resources are used in any given level.

Now if there needed to be significant engine changes in order to facilitate the depth of new features they planned for the new campaign, then they could easily have versioned up to a 1.5 or something to communicate the significant differences between the feature-set of the original and the updated in preparation for an expansion DLC.

Sure there are new weapons, and melee. Arguably these should have been in the first already. Why not patch this into the 1.5 as a bonus of getting the expansion? then customers could use new weapons in the original campaign, melee, etc.

Sure there are new locations, new gameplay types. Level differences and scripts. Absolutely not a reason for a new game.

A new UI, on the other hand, is pretty much required if you're going to make a new game. Mainly to address complaints and prevent confusion among players about which game they might be playing. It, in-and-of-itself, is no reason at all to make a new game. UI's go through several revisions during testing anyway. An expansion could change the UI, if only to signify it's presence or address problems with a prior one.

For the most part, Left 4 Dead is exactly the same as Left 4 Dead 2, except for a few superfluous differences: characters, locations, and features available to the player. Any expansion, DLC could add those differences. The plot is the same: zombie apocalypse. The mechanics are the same: kill zombies, using weapons and teamwork to survive. The universe is identical, save for different locations in the same country. There are new features in l4d2; this does not a new game make. New characters and locations do not make a new game, either. A new chapter or campaign, perhaps.

I can see doing it on the basis of extreme quality differences such as: 3x spoken dialog; higher-res textures and models on everything; 4x as many polys everywhere; new, more realistic, natural environment algorithms all around; use anything in the environment as a weapon, even the enemy. I would consider at least 2 of any of those necessary to qualify for a new game, versus an medium-larger expansion. Realistically, L4D2 didn't come close on any of those points.

I hold fast to the idea that Valve released it as a separate game simply to make more money. DLC could probably fetch $30 tops from customers, while a new game would go for $50. Less work for them, for more money in return. Let's call it greed—or capitalism, if you prefer.

Yes, if each aspect we've mentioned was its own addon, there would be no problem with it. But putting everything together is a lot different. The game was redesigned from the ground up. The way the level works, the increased re-playability due to the director changing maps around, etc.

Lets look at the bigger picture here. Valve tend to focus more on episodic gaming, but they seem to miss the point. The three tenets of this are shorter games, for lower prices, released more frequently. With the Half-Life series, they struggled with releasing games more frequently. With L4D, they've kept the price too high. $50 IS a bit pricey for something like this, but it certainly isn't DLC.

Take it from a different standpoint. What I've been hearing from everyone is that L4D2 is the same as L4D with the story, characters, plot, and setting changed, with the feel kept the same. Now, lets go back to the Oblivion vs. Fallout argument. Take Oblivion. Change the story to one about survival, change the characters to people trying to survive from day to day, lets change the plot to a post-apocalyptic nightmare, and the setting to future DC. Now we have Fallout.

Lets do the same thing with L4D. Let's change the story from creepy survival horror to one of escaping the infection, lets change and add characters to those with new backstories in the deep south, the plot from escapism to humanity on the brink of extinction, and the setting to the Deep South. Now we have L4D2.

Continuing on.

You said that quite a few games offer the ability to add campaigns, etc. Do you have any idea how many add-on campaigns there are for L4D? A ****load. Not many of them are good.

As for the Fallout DLC, yes, two of them were not in the DC area. One was onboard Mothership Zeta, and the other was in Anchorage, Alaska. However, these still retained the idea of your current playthrough. It was still your character, and still your karma. It continued the adventure. L4D2 did NOT continue the story of the four survivors. It introduced all new characters, and therefore, an all new story. For the L4D DLC to follow the path of the FO3 DLC, you need:

1.) The same characters
2.) Following said characters on a story different from what they have already done.
3.) New game elements (weapons, items, innovations, etc.)

They did this. It was called Crash Course.

I'll agree that it was overpriced though. Left 4 Dead in general lacks a unifying story to keep it all together. And that's one of the most important things in a game.

 
HonestGamer  posted on Feb 04, 2010 10:47:25 PM - Report post

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I am a little confused...The game feels like a mod, but its better that its a seperate title.

And the game costs only 15 bucks here (Original)...So yeah its worth it.

 
Evanscense  posted on Feb 04, 2010 11:48:22 PM - Report post

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You didn't know Iran is Game prices paradise?
 
HonestGamer  posted on Feb 05, 2010 12:02:43 AM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by Evanscense

You didn't know Iran is Game prices paradise?

but they all are pirated...

 
Evanscense  posted on Feb 05, 2010 12:06:38 AM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by HonestGamer

quote:
originally posted by Evanscense

You didn't know Iran is Game prices paradise?

but they all are pirated...

Certainly there is mystery behind this subject...
And that is what you said..

 
fsmcas  posted on Feb 24, 2010 11:04:32 AM - Report post

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L4D2 is great, but never worth this money (its multiplayer, and multiplayer is NEVER worth a full price). But on amazon.co.uk I got it for 20 bugs which was ok
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