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PC - Opinions wanted...
 
AdmiralThrawn  posted on Mar 24, 2011 2:42:55 PM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by DAB

Do NOT OC your CPU. Only idiots do that.

Care to explain?

 
Drakonis  posted on Mar 24, 2011 2:58:26 PM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by AdmiralThrawn

quote:
originally posted by DAB

Do NOT OC your CPU. Only idiots do that.

Care to explain?

Yes, please explain. OCing can be a great way in getting a faster CPU at a cheaper price. Many CPU's are designed to be OC'd, like the Black Edition AMD cpus. Of course you should know what you are doing before you attempt to OC though.

 
DABhand  posted on Mar 24, 2011 3:22:07 PM - Report post

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The Black Edition CPU's don't differ at all in hardware to the regular CPU's, except for one thing... one byte of information. It allows motherboards to OC it fully, thats all 1 byte. They are the same hardware..

Anyways...

Even with the latest liquid cooling etc it doesn't matter sooner or later the hardware will fail, the CPU's are not designed to run at an extra 500mhz-1ghz for a prolonged length of time, in turn it will slowly degrade the hardware to the point it begins to fail and then will quickly degrade due to it already failing.

In a sense your not OC'ing the CPU per say, but the motherboard mostly not only are you increasing voltage to the port, but you have to increase the HT, DDR speeds etc to cope with the increase in speed. So even more hardware is under stress, you may be able to cool your CPU down well with liquid cooling and the ROM chip, but not much motherboards will allow complete cooling if your going to OC.

 
DABhand  posted on Mar 24, 2011 3:29:46 PM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by Drakonis

quote:
originally posted by DABhand

Value RAM is not fine, they don't have great timings.

The timings will make no noticeable difference in games. You will not see any noticeable difference with one ram that has timings of 7-7-7-21 and one at 9-9-9-24.

The only thing performance ram will make a difference in is if you plan to OC the RAM.

[Edited by Drakonis, 3/24/2011 2:50:30 PM]

[Edited by Drakonis, 3/24/2011 2:52:24 PM]

[Edited by Drakonis, 3/24/2011 2:53:15 PM]

Don't mention the first 4 numbers those are generic with all RAM. If you had 1 strip of 7-7-7-21 and one at 9-9-9-24 the reason you don't notice a difference is because the system will take into account the slower.

Same with clock speeds, say DDR3 1666 1GB and you also have 1GB of DDR3 1333, both will run at 1333.

But the real information you want is above the CAS, tRCD, tRP, tRAS. After there there is even more timings and thats the difference between value RAM and quality RAM, the quality RAM has better timings.

 
Shibby  posted on Mar 24, 2011 4:10:20 PM - Report post

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I'll leave Overclocking to the experts/adventurous

Ok so 1333MHz RAM instead, sounds good, will go with Value RAM anyway since well if it does turn out to be crap it's easily replaceable

And will look into the 890FX chipset MB's and see what I can get here (or shipped from overseas) and also see about getting a 5870 or Nvidia 460

Will stick with Phenom II X4 965 as it should be sufficient

Initially I was looking at about $1600NZD / $1100 USD but will revise that now, shouldn't be too much difference though, plus I get paid next Wednesday anyway yay

Thanks heaps guys, really appreciate the advice, I'd be clueless without it

 
Drakonis  posted on Mar 24, 2011 5:17:15 PM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by DABhand

The Black Edition CPU's don't differ at all in hardware to the regular CPU's, except for one thing... one byte of information. It allows motherboards to OC it fully, thats all 1 byte. They are the same hardware..

Anyways...

Even with the latest liquid cooling etc it doesn't matter sooner or later the hardware will fail, the CPU's are not designed to run at an extra 500mhz-1ghz for a prolonged length of time, in turn it will slowly degrade the hardware to the point it begins to fail and then will quickly degrade due to it already failing.

In a sense your not OC'ing the CPU per say, but the motherboard mostly not only are you increasing voltage to the port, but you have to increase the HT, DDR speeds etc to cope with the increase in speed. So even more hardware is under stress, you may be able to cool your CPU down well with liquid cooling and the ROM chip, but not much motherboards will allow complete cooling if your going to OC.

Yes, the black editions unlock the multiplier so you can OC. That's the point, they are designed to be OC'd. Many people have no problems with their OC'd machines. As long as you don't try and OC your computer to ridiculous amounts it will be fine and as long as everything is properly cooled it will be fine. Obviously there is always a risk in OCing. As long as you keep your parts cool and stable everything will be fine. Keeping your motherboard cool is where case fans and airflow come into play. There are motherboards that are designed for OCing also, of course they are expensive. OCing is fine as long as you have the right parts and knowledge. If not, don't try it.

[Edited by Drakonis, 3/24/2011 5:18:36 PM]

[Edited by Drakonis, 3/24/2011 5:49:15 PM]

[Edited by Drakonis, 3/24/2011 5:52:26 PM]

 
Drakonis  posted on Mar 24, 2011 5:36:57 PM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by DABhand

quote:
originally posted by Drakonis

quote:
originally posted by DABhand

Value RAM is not fine, they don't have great timings.

The timings will make no noticeable difference in games. You will not see any noticeable difference with one ram that has timings of 7-7-7-21 and one at 9-9-9-24.

The only thing performance ram will make a difference in is if you plan to OC the RAM.

[Edited by Drakonis, 3/24/2011 2:50:30 PM]

[Edited by Drakonis, 3/24/2011 2:52:24 PM]

[Edited by Drakonis, 3/24/2011 2:53:15 PM]

Don't mention the first 4 numbers those are generic with all RAM. If you had 1 strip of 7-7-7-21 and one at 9-9-9-24 the reason you don't notice a difference is because the system will take into account the slower.

Same with clock speeds, say DDR3 1666 1GB and you also have 1GB of DDR3 1333, both will run at 1333.

But the real information you want is above the CAS, tRCD, tRP, tRAS. After there there is even more timings and thats the difference between value RAM and quality RAM, the quality RAM has better timings.

Which still will make no noticeable difference in games. I wasn't talking about having one strip of lower ram and one strip of higher ram. I was saying even with the better timings the difference isn't that large that you will notice a difference. You will be lucky if you get maybe 1-2 fps more in a game.

Value RAM runs at a certain speed and will not OC very well. Performance ram is designed to run higher if necessary, that is the difference.

Here is a decent article, a couple years old but goes into testing different ram speeds. If you are an overclocker, you want the performance ram, otherwise not that much of a difference. Not to mention the rest of your machine has more effect on your gaming than ram timings.

www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ram-speed-tests,1807.html

 
Drakonis  posted on Mar 24, 2011 5:42:43 PM - Report post

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quote:
originally posted by Shibby

I'll leave Overclocking to the experts/adventurous

Ok so 1333MHz RAM instead, sounds good, will go with Value RAM anyway since well if it does turn out to be crap it's easily replaceable

And will look into the 890FX chipset MB's and see what I can get here (or shipped from overseas) and also see about getting a 5870 or Nvidia 460

Will stick with Phenom II X4 965 as it should be sufficient

Initially I was looking at about $1600NZD / $1100 USD but will revise that now, shouldn't be too much difference though, plus I get paid next Wednesday anyway yay

Thanks heaps guys, really appreciate the advice, I'd be clueless without it

For $1,100 you can get a very nice set up. Since you are getting an AMD mobo, you might want to consider one that has crossfire and get a single 5870 and then a second in the future. By the way, what resolution is your monitor?

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